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bread

Postby Hope » Thu Sep 10, 2020 8:14 pm

My breadmachine broke last week. I'm having a go at making it by hand (well, using the kenwood chef, because I can't knead!) (this is for the rest of the family as I can't eat it!)

I've made some rather successful rolls, and some no-knead bread.

I'd like to make a loaf, hand shaped (not in my gluten-free tin) using the same dough as I used for rolls, but I've no idea how long to bake it for. It would be made with 300g of flour (or two loaves made with 300g of flour each). Any ideas?

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Re: bread

Postby Pepper Pig » Thu Sep 10, 2020 9:00 pm

I think KC2 is your girl.

ETA Hello again Hope, nice to see you!
Last edited by Pepper Pig on Thu Sep 10, 2020 10:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: bread

Postby aero280 » Thu Sep 10, 2020 10:33 pm

It will depend a bit on your oven. The key bit is to knock the bottom of the loaf and it's done if it sounds hollow. It it isn't do it a bit longer.

If you like your bread a bit dark and crusty, start with a high oven and then turn it down.

For rolls, I generally do them for 20 mins at 200ºC.

For my main regular loaf, with 650g of flour, it's 20 mins at 220ºC plus about 45 mins at around 180ºC in a fan oven.

Your loaves are smaller. I would try them at say 15 mins at 220ºC followed by 30min at 180ºC and then see if you need longer.

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Re: bread

Postby ZeroCook » Fri Sep 11, 2020 2:02 am

Hope, Back in the day Dan Lepard was no-knead master and this white loaf is as simple and easy as it gets. I've never used a bread machine but am sure this would give any machine a run for its money. The overnight method gives really great flavour and texture results. Also breaks breadmaking into shorter time chunks. This recipe uses 350g flour.
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... nk.baking8
DL's quantities and timings are always pretty spot on. I use olive oil instead of butter etc. Worth chasing down other recipes of his.

Timings for a 500g loaf (that's dough weight using 300-350g flour) are generally around 40 - 45 minutes at 220 deg/200 fan or in this recipe a fierce bake at 240 deg/220 fan for 20 minutes and turn down to 200deg/180 fan for final 20-25.

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Re: bread

Postby Hope » Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:45 am

thank you

Zerocook - just checking - does it make any difference to the cooking time when doing wholemeal bread?

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Re: bread

Postby aero280 » Fri Sep 11, 2020 9:17 am

Bread is pretty forgiving on baking times. I once forgot to turn the oven down half way through :o The bread was “a bit crusty”, but perfectly edible.

For a 300g loaf, I would aim for around 45 mins total baking time. Keep an eye on it from a bit before then. If it’s dark enough for your taste, do the bottom knocking test. If it needs more time, just put it back in for a bit longer.

There’s no real difference between white and wholemeal baking times. It’s more likely to vary a bit with the wetness of the dough.

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Re: bread

Postby dennispc » Fri Sep 11, 2020 9:44 am

I’ve got Dan Lepard’s the Handmade Loaf and admire his contributions to bread making, but for an overnight loaf I don’t think there’s need to scald a bowl before using - well I never have. I follow the mantra of half the flour and all of the yeast and water. Mix, leave overnight covered, add rest of flour and oil next day. Before we had a KitchenAid his no knead method was perfect.

Temperature for bread and rolls is 230C, about twenty minutes for rolls. 40 plus for loaf.

Generally, wholemeal loaf needs more water I find, so probably another five or ten minutes baking time, as aero 280 posted. Forget to turn oven down most times I bake!

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Re: bread

Postby scullion » Fri Sep 11, 2020 10:57 am

i think bread is, often, equally forgiving on temperature, too.
we bake bread in a tube in the sun. there have been occasions when the sun has gone in and the tube has only got up to between 150°c and 180°c. it may not be the perfect bake but it's still bread.
it maybe due to the shape - 300g of flour, mixed enough to combine (no kneading whatsoever) left to prove overnight and put into a 'trough' the next morning so it's a 'sub'/baton shape when it's baked.

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Re: bread

Postby ZeroCook » Sat Sep 12, 2020 2:37 am

Hope wrote:thank you

Zerocook - just checking - does it make any difference to the cooking time when doing wholemeal bread?


Pretty much the same timings. But that would be for the same hydration/water to flour ratio.
This is Dan L's wholemeal loaf. He uses a bit of vitamin C and adds a little sugar.
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... k.baking13
I'm a bit of a purist and not in love with adding small amounts of sugar to plain bread recipes - I leave it out. I like the bread flavour you get from flour/grains/seeds, salt, water and yeast. But hey. I know that some people feel that all-wholemeal loaves are slightly bitter but Ive never found that so. Best way is to try it out etc.

dennispc - totally agree - you so don't need to scald the bowl for an overnight prove! I know what you mean about different flour absorbancies - the strong white flour I like seems to absorb more water than others. Is your wholemeal extra high in gluten?

That's amazing, without using an oven, Scullion

.

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Re: bread

Postby halfateabag » Sat Sep 12, 2020 8:52 am

presently enjoying a shop bought sunflower and rye sliced loaf :yum

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Re: bread

Postby Badger's Mate » Sat Sep 12, 2020 9:25 am

It seems unwise to lay down hard and fast rules. Some people do one thing, some another and it works for them. People here and elsewhere show that bread can be made without added yeast, salt, sugar, wheat or even an oven. Writers suggest filtered or bottled water for sourdough, others tap, saying the former isn't necessary. I know that my sourdough starters and bakes have done better with cooled boiled tap water than with fresh. Those with less chlorinated water might have no problems. Maybe DL has had problems with unwelcome microbial contamination and long proves, my sourdoughs have. I've always assumed that sugar is added as a raising agent with commercial yeast rather than a sweetener.

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Re: bread

Postby dennispc » Sat Sep 12, 2020 4:33 pm

It’s good to see so many posters with the same level of common sense as me! :lol: There are as many different ways of baking bread as there are folk who make them, so all in favour of whatever works for individuals.

Bread is so forgiving, put flour, yeast and water together and you can’t help making bread.

My understanding about sugar, it was used with fresh yeast and warm water for the bacteria to feed on. Never bothered myself.

KeenCook, I tend to use very strong wholemeal bread flour, which does give a better rise and higher gluten, but add white as well.

8.30pm yesterday, 300g wholemeal bread flour into KitchenAid bowl, plus sachet of Sainsbury’s yeast plus 325g of water. Mixed and covered overnight.

6.45am today, added 200g white bread flour, heaped tsp of salt and a glug or two of olive oil. KitchenAid, two minutes on lowest speed, 6 on next speed. Added water as needed, to make a wet dough. Oil on worktop and hands, tip out, shape, into tin. An hour’s rise and 45mins at 230C. Deliberately didn’t turn it down as it gives a stronger flavour to the crust, for me.

wholemeal .jpg
wholemeal .jpg (187.77 KiB) Viewed 106 times

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Re: bread

Postby KeenCook2 » Sat Sep 12, 2020 6:17 pm

That looks perfect, dennispc :thumbsup :yum

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Re: bread

Postby dennispc » Sun Sep 13, 2020 5:16 pm

That's praise indeed, KeenCook2. Purists might say it needed to rise a bit more (true) so the slash left a rounded top. It tasted good and that's all that matters. Noticed an old pot of molasses in the back of the cupboard - might add that next time.

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